L100 grills - reproduction!!??

[boputnam]

Originally posted by Ian Mackenzie
True Even on paper the 4313 is smoother by design, and that must translate into the listening experience... I recall saying my God, these capture eveything after I pulling my E bay L100's specials out of the tea chests and wiring them up the the Aleph 2.

Yea, I take your point.

It's just that, guys like that dang Giskard keep challenging me (read: us) here to re-test our long-held passionately defended opinions with real critical listening. And dang it ! (oh, already said that... ) he's oh-so-often right!!

Me, like Widget here, are likewise just trying to softly encourage some of that same, critical listening, while we have a Forum to dicuss the "whys" and "howcomes".

The saying "ignorance is bliss" never saved me so much money before all THIS!! But, then again, I haven't had this much fun just listening to music since I got me my own first Altecs in 1974.

But thinking again, maybe L100 bashing has run its course. I should encourage the seeking of the Orange Waffle Holy Grail 'cause it keeps them off the real quest - Studio Monitors!

[4313B]

Here is the schematic of the original C533 that JBL designed for Bob Fine. This is the loudspeaker that started it all.

[4313B]

Attached is a zip file with the rest of the schematics. One should note that the original L100 has 2nd-order filters instead of the 1st-order filters found in the other systems.

The 4311 is "next generation" and isn't included.

*****

Also note - this LX30 as posted above is not to be confused with the LX30 as offered in the Loudspeaker Component Series. That LX30 was a "refined" version of the N65 network and it was to be used with the 124A/124H, LE5-2/LE5H, and 077.

[Ian Mackenzie]

Wow, they are way too cool schematics Giskard.

Hey Bo,

I love critical listening too, that why I own JBL's and don't get much done at home if I turn'm on.

And they (my L100's) are about to go into primary service while I file a new baffle to my wife (4345) and it will be an interesting transition.

Here are my babies, the last owner made nice blue cloth covers just like the JBL ones but I do prefer them off for more open sound. I have however replaced the foam around the tweeter and mount them in spiked stands.

Hmm, anyone gotta Citation 16/19 they wonna trade?

AAA Excellent (for rear surround)

Ian

[boputnam]

Originally posted by Giskard
Here is the schematic of the original C533 that JBL designed for Bob Fine. This is the loudspeaker that started it all.

Very interesting how they allowed the LF to just roll-off naturally, without incorporating any low-pass filter. This carried over into the earliest 43xx series, too.

[4313B]

As well as quite a few other designs.
The Lancer 77 comes to mind.

You will see that the C533 became the 4310 in the schematics.

[Ian Mackenzie]

Yeah,

Well if the driver can behave itself and rolloff with controlled break up at say 6bd per octave who needs a crossover?

I figure all the white bird dun in the woofer helps with that

1 st order crossovers have superior transient performance and no crossover is even better!

Ian

[Rusnzha]

When I hit powerball, I will seek out a set of 4345s. I would have to mortgage my house to swing it now and I already did that. In the meantime I'll get by just fine with my L100s. I got them on spiked stands and hooked up to a Luxman R114 and it still sounds better than 90% of the stuff out there. Thanks for the info, it gives me something to think about.

Russ

[speakerdave]

You go, Russ! It's important to remember that none of this stuff is perfect. If your hi fi delivers the music and doesn't annoy you in the process, that's enough.

I'll never forget the time in the seventies I went to hear some Magnepans and a Spectro-acoustics amp. It was the hot stuff. It sounded pretty good, and I was quite impressed--until the guy at the drum kit started hitting the high hat, and it was on the CEILING! I just started laughing, and I always remember this when I start thinking of some little imperfection in whatever system I'm listening to, and then I turn back to the music. I'm not saying there isn't good and great. I'm just saying no one needs to be pathological and broke about this hobby.

I just gave my son a pair of 4311s and a Crown 150A that he can listen to in his college digs and also to fill out a little DJ kit he can tuck into a hatchback. He couldn't be happier. (The speakers may sound good to him because he listened to his Dad's 604 8Gs for many years.) Are these speakers perfect? No . . . and neither is anything you could buy to replace them, but, like you say, they're better than a lot of stuff out there.

Enjoy the music.

David

[Rusnzha]

Right on, Dave. That setup you gave your son is one of the best things that can be given without breaking the bank. I'm sure it will give him years of pleasure.

Thanks,

Russ

[sonofagun]

Originally posted by Don McRitchie
Last October, a member of our old forum posted that he was taking advance orders for exact replacements of L100 grills and replacements for all other JBL/Altec speakers that used foam grills. Never heard from him after that. If you want to try and get a hold of him, his email address was:

[email protected]

Hi all: Yes I posted that I might be offering replacement foam grilles again. Used to make and sell them years ago (approx 1975-85). Unfortunately am not offering them right now for a couple reasons: The special foam is not easy to obtain unless you buy it in quantities more than my VERY meager budget can afford (takes $500 or more). Also making the grilles is rather tedious and exacting (especially the L100s) and requires some special tooling (no, you CANNOT make them with a router). Ideally a computer driven cutting setup would make things easier, but again I don't have the capital or know-how to do this (although I do have an engineering background). I used to make L100s (and others) pretty much manually. Offering them again would force me to make a considerable commitment of time and energy both of which seem to be in shorter supply not being as young as I used to be!

Anyone interested in partnering to make these? Maybe someone near me or with some expertise in computer/machine design and some capital or time to invest. Production/order quantities on the order of 30 and up pairs per month (not just L100s) would be necessary to justify costs involved in setting up. The grilles I made were superior to the originals made from a non-deteriorating foam. And I worked out the best way to paint them for colors (including burnt orange!).
Later dudes.

[boputnam]

Originally posted by sonofagun
no, you CANNOT make them with a router

Doh!

Hey, Widget! Sounds like you gotta a little pm'ing to do...

[Mr. Widget]

I am afraid I've already got a few too many waffles on my plate.

I am way behind delivering 4343 name plates among other things.

[sonofagun]

Yes, I advertised them on eBay, but making them fell through

BUT HEY -

All of you that would like new grilles. email me so I get a feel for how much interest there is.

I also made foam replacements for other makes and models including the L200s and Altecs 7, 9, 15, and Valencia models in addition to custom orders.

[Rusnzha]

It's a bummer. I was hoping there would be some action on this. Since it seems to be going nowhere, I guess I'll get out the old waffle grill and make them out of batter.