Project Finally under way

[4313B]

Why would one do that ? There's no need ( obviously ) to mess around with such a successful design .

<> cheers

I mentioned using my pair of H4338 horns in the same orientation as the 4338 a few weeks ago and it was suggested at the time to try vertical ala Array. The suggestion was followed up by an email a few days later so I suspect I should probably at least try it.

I just haven't been able to come up with a design that looks neato. I doubt I would do something as nice as John W did a few years ago.

[Zilch]

- Here's another waveguide which, ( by the same defining parameters ) should have strong imaging capability ( though the good Doctor would be loath to agree because of the inclusion of a diffraction slot in the throat ).

No actual slot, rather, a similarly loathsome diffraction "device" in the contoured flare....

[Earl K]

I doubt I would do something as nice as John W did a few years ago.

There's the rub / John W is in a very exclusive club .

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[timc]

There's the rub / John W is in a very exclusive club .

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IMO John W is not IN a club. He IS the club.......


All humble respect to the other woodworkers in here.



-Tim

[Earl K]

No actual slot, rather, a similarly loathsome diffraction "device" in the contoured flare....

Yes, you're right , I shouldn't have used the word "slot" in my description .

<> cheers

[Zilch]

Unlike a true slot, you have to look REAL hard to find the "culprit."

I believe we beat Earl back pretty well on these issues, Rob and I, with respect to PT waveguides. In the end, he admitted, "Better than ordinary diffraction horns...."

[timc]

Ok. I have done some tweaking to the filter to make it compatible with avaible components. Not as smooth in simultaion, but close.


So. I have the 2213 woofer. My friend is currently looking for a high performance 12" woofer to mate to his driver/horn. We are currently looking at the JBL 2206H and the Fostex W300 AII.


Is the 2206 totally unsuited for this application without subwoofer?



-Tim

[4313B]

Ok. I have done some tweaking to the filter to make it compatible with avaible components. Not as smooth in simultaion, but close.

Just so it sounds good is all you care about.

Is the 2206 totally unsuited for this application without subwoofer?

Probably. The 1200FE has about a half octave more bottom end and it can sound a little thin with some media. The 2204H falls in between but it has a larger box requirement than either the 2206 or 1200FE.

You might end up liking the old 2213 just fine. :dont-know

[timc]

Just so it sounds good is all you care about.Probably. The 1200FE has about a half octave more bottom end and it can sound a little thin with some media. The 2204H falls in between but it has a larger box requirement than either the 2206 or 1200FE.

You might end up liking the old 2213 just fine. :dont-know

I hope ill enjoy the 2213. The alternative is for a friend who have joined in on the project. So we are making 2 pairs. The second woofers are for him.

Is the 1200Fe-8 still avaiable for purchase? I got the impression it was not avaiable anymore.

If it still is ill call him. He prolly want them asap

-Tim

[badman]

The 2213 is a very nice woofer, with good frequency exension and smooth response. It's dramatically less efficient than many other JBL woofers, being more of a home-hifi beast. This is achieved by a slightly less powerful motor and a significantly heavier, coated cone. It wants a very big box, but will go very deep in 4 ft+ sealed. Vented would want to be ginormous. The top end (goes to 5k, fairly flat) is rough (sonically, not FR), as you might expect from such a driver. The good news is, it's easily acoustically attenuated. I put a 5X4 rectangle of 1/8" acoustic F11 felt on the inside of a grille over the driver and got a 6dB/oct rolloff at 2kHz, fairly consistent both on and off axis. This matches the phase well, so with a zoebel, you can overlay it as if it were an additional pole on an electrical filter (without the zoebel, the impedance curve will throw off your electrical poles).

[timc]

Thanks for the tip Badman. I will try a closed box as well.


Soldered the filter for the horn together today and did a test run with them together with the woofer of my l65. I used the Copland DRC to compensate for unoptimized crossover between the woofer and horn. It was close, but no cigar.

OMG! The sound from the horn is awesome. There are none of the peaks and dips that bugged me while listening to the previous design. And to be honest, the L65 woofer did a fair job too.

I will get the measured curves from the Copland tomorrow, but i could not hear a big difference between before and after from the horn alone. That is a good sign

So, I'm a very happy camper now.


-Tim

[4313B]

OMG! The sound from the horn is awesome.

Where'd the "horn sound" go?

Oh, we got rid of that years ago...

[Ian Mackenzie]

Where'd the "horn sound" go?

Oh, we got rid of that years ago...

Yeah I thought the E2's sounded too Hifi.

There are some interesting and radical ideas floating around about all horn system like The Living Voice Vox Olympian. (Vitavox and Tad drivers). Its is acost no object loudspeaker

All horn system are on the way back in hi end circles.

This article is worth a read in terms of how they came up with the particular components and the configuration. See the LG2 Bronze over aluminium for the HF horn and time alignment of the horns.
http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatur.../olympian.html

[timc]

Yeah I thought the E2's sounded too Hifi.

Are you kidding, or serious?

If serious, what was it you didn't like?


-Tim

[4313B]

Yeah I thought the E2's sounded too Hifi.

I prefer Greg's 1200 Arrays. E2's are too wide and dominating for my environment. They are seriously fantastic though. I've got the single woofer version.

All horn system are on the way back in hi end circles.

I'm not a big horn fan and I'm certainly not in the high end circles. I have no interest in those goings on.

Which reminds me, did you see alot of Tannoy while you were in Japan? They're supposed to be more popular there than JBL. I wouldn't know anything about that.

Are you kidding, or serious?

If serious, what was it you didn't like?


-Tim

I would imagine that he didn't like the fact that the airlines considered them too big for carry on... that's about the only thing wrong with them that I can figure.