Dumb thought: Anyone ever compared an L7 and an L300 side-by-side?

[BMWCCA]

Setting up sound for the Eli Cook Band and one other on Saturday (He opened for B.B. King here recently). Then leaving for a week on Monday. Sorry. Plenty of time coming up though.

[Fred Sanford]

The DC trip is going to be decided on the fly, and would be in order to hook up with some AK members for an informal meet & greet on Saturday. Chances are I'll bring some toys for show & tell and some potential sales.

Piling on that, I might be meeting a friend in Alexandria to swap some Nak gear for a guitar.

All in all, a very loose plan, and still no better than a maybe at this point. I've got Heather's phone #, and will be in touch if I'm DC-bound, but don't count on me to schedule anything at this point.

I'm up for a H'burg or C'Ville meet just about any time, with some notice.

je

[Fred Sanford]

Well, I'll be home Sat ... have to work from my desk briefly on Sunday, but Emma is await preaching ... at the Hburg UU church! So ... if Fred is in DC this weekend anyway ... if we don't go too late, we could arrange multispeakers in the living room (with all the plants). Hard wood floors - the L200-plus (quasi L-300) speakers are on wheels and easy to move around - but honestly, its Phil's idea so isn't it kinda pointless without him and his L7s??

Maybe its best if we wait a few weeks - ?

Please tell Emma she's welcome to drop by if she'd like, or give us details on her H'burg appearance & maybe we can go see her.

je

[SEAWOLF97]

Hey Phil , why dont you look into a 240ti ?

I did buy a pair of 240Ti's to replace them though. The 100t's were just too big of a jump backwards. The beauty of the 240 is they can be substituted for the 100T's without anyone noticing
These are way under rated. Close in sound to a 250Ti at 1/3 the price & not quite so pretty

[macaroonie]

Oft forgotten. A good point well made

[BMWCCA]

Hey Phil , why dont you look into a 240ti ?

I've always said that was one speaker I thought should be a keeper but I've never heard one. Contacted someone selling a pair for a handsome sum recently one-state away, with no photos, but no reply. Also spoke with a friend in the Florida keys (Hi!) recently who had three pairs and was thinking about selling. Haven't gotten a follow-up on those.

We're thinking along the same lines though. One of us is quicker, more motivated, closer to the source, and with money burning a hole in his pocket from recent sales!

[SEAWOLF97]

Hey Phil , why dont you look into a 240ti ?

I've always said that was one speaker I thought should be a keeper but I've never heard one. Contacted someone selling a pair for a handsome sum recently one-state away, with no photos, but no reply. Also spoke with a friend in the Florida keys (Hi!) recently who had three pairs and was thinking about selling. Haven't gotten a follow-up on those.

We're thinking along the same lines though. One of us is quicker, more motivated, closer to the source, and with money burning a hole in his pocket from recent sales!

I guess shud have looked b4 recommendation....if you have to pay this much..

http://cgi.ebay.com/JBL-240ti-LOUDSP...QQcmdZViewItem

then mite as well go "all the way" on the bigger speakers..

[BMWCCA]

I guess shud have looked b4 recommendation....if you have to pay this much..

http://cgi.ebay.com/JBL-240ti-LOUDSP...QQcmdZViewItem

then mite as well go "all the way" on the bigger speakers..

Notice they didn't get a bid. I've talked to a seller about a pair closer to me but he thinks at something North of $1500 that he's selling them way below market. I wouldn't consider them a good deal at close to $1000. In the end, this stuff all boils down to justification based on component value, or emotions.

[BMWCCA]

The recent thread hoping to compare the L220 with the 250ti got me thinking we'd better move on this L7 versus L300/4333A before the snow closes off Fred's driveway for the season. This weekend I'll be in New York. Every weekend from now until the first of December I have only Sundays open, or the weekend of Thanksgiving, though that may have some daughter-shuttling duties yet unscheduled. Any of those days look like something you two, Heather and Fred, would like to work toward? Still want to go through with this?

I've been giving some thought to how we share the source signal. I have an older Sony CD player I use as my main source. It has both a fixed and a variable (front panel output driven by motor from the remote) output pair which could be used to balance the systems but not to switch between them. I can supply two Crown PS-400 amps but I can't supply matching pre-amps to run two identical systems. I could bring a Soundcraftsmen DX4200 and a ProControl Four. Both are very clean but they're not identical. I'm working on a Soundcraftsmen ProPower Four amp which has dual speaker outputs but no level controls. I do have this silly SAE speaker switching system which supposedly handles 350 watts and controls up to three pairs, but I've not tried it out, and it leaves no way to balance the level betwen the pairs.

Fred, do you have any suggestion for how we give both speaker pairs a level playing field without dismantling your set-up? Do you have a better CD source or should we have Heather schlep the Oppo along? What negative effect do we introduce if we simply split the output from the pre-amp to two power amps? Would it work with the two amps as long as we had the gain up? I have two pre-amps I can bring, just not identical units.

Is interest still in favor of giving this a try? Is Fred still interested in donating the space if I bring bagels?

[Fred Sanford]

The recent thread hoping to compare the L220 with the 250ti got me thinking we'd better move on this L7 versus L300/4333A before the snow closes off Fred's driveway for the season.

Is interest still in favor of giving this a try? Is Fred still interested in donating the space if I bring bagels?

OK, there's a bunch of things to answer here, I'll type 'til I'm tired then I'll decide that this would be easier to accomplish in a simple phone call.

1] Snow doesn't really close us off, ice storms do. Heather's CR-V shouldn't be any issue, dunno if you've got any xi's on the road these days.

2] I have two Adcom 2535s. They're possibly perfect for this purpose for a couple reasons- they're each 4 power amps in one chassis, 60WPC each. There are gain controls for each pair of amps, so you can balance for spl output between pairs. Downside is that one of these is currently bi-amping my 4333As, which I think you want to compare to the L7s without the active x-over in play. Not tough to re-wire, really. How power-hungry are the L7s?

I also have four Yamaha P2100s, they're ~95WPC and have gain controls on the fronts. Nice amps, easy to rack up two of them & cart them up to the living room. I could even use all four bridged for more power, but that would take some dismantling & a big rack to hold all four at once.

I also have three multi-zone power amps that can buss inputs across multiple outputs.

I also have a DC300 if you've got a sister for it.

I also have a 6260, I think Heather's got a sister for that.

I don't think power amps will be an issue .

3] My current setup in the LR is a Pioneer DVL-91 Elite (LD/DVD/CD) into a nice-sounding Marantz DAC with a level controlled output (can run with sub & x-over, or not) and a fixed-level output. Easy enough to control & balance the two outputs, one from the DAC and one from the amp. Any digital source can be added & switched in if the Pioneer Elite doesn't tickle your fancy. There are also three ReQuest music servers with CD drawers, two DATs, some Denon CDs with digital out, an Alesis Masterlink, a Sony ES CD player, and maybe 6 other Pioneer players. No TTs and no SACD at this point, sorry.

I have an Zektor HDS4.2 as well, that can do analog & digital switching easily & quietly.

http://www.zektor.com/hds42/index.html

http://www.zektor.com/hds42/images/HDS42S_back_1000.jpg

4] Sundays might be good, there's also a Thursday and Friday coming up where my wife's out of town and I'm not booked up, so if weekdays work that might be an option. Thanksgiving's no good.

Call me!

je

[hjames]

Fred sounds like Tgiving is out - I'm tied the weekend of Oct 25-26, and I'm offline on Thanksgiving day -
but elsewhere in the weekend could work out ... The 4341s are just too big to haul, but we could prolly load the L200 -3-way pair ...

The recent thread hoping to compare the L220 with the 250ti got me thinking we'd better move on this L7 versus L300/4333A before the snow closes off Fred's driveway for the season. This weekend I'll be in New York. Every weekend from now until the first of December I have only Sundays open, or the weekend of Thanksgiving, though that may have some daughter-shuttling duties yet unscheduled. Any of those days look like something you two, Heather and Fred, would like to work toward? Still want to go through with this?

I've been giving some thought to how we share the source signal. I have an older Sony CD player I use as my main source. It has both a fixed and a variable (front panel output driven by motor from the remote) output pair which could be used to balance the systems but not to switch between them. I can supply two Crown PS-400 amps but I can't supply matching pre-amps to run two identical systems. I could bring a Soundcraftsmen DX4200 and a ProControl Four. Both are very clean but they're not identical. I'm working on a Soundcraftsmen ProPower Four amp which has dual speaker outputs but no level controls. I do have this silly SAE speaker switching system which supposedly handles 350 watts and controls up to three pairs, but I've not tried it out, and it leaves no way to balance the level betwen the pairs.

Fred, do you have any suggestion for how we give both speaker pairs a level playing field without dismantling your set-up? Do you have a better CD source or should we have Heather schlep the Oppo along? What negative effect do we introduce if we simply split the output from the pre-amp to two power amps? Would it work with the two amps as long as we had the gain up? I have two pre-amps I can bring, just not identical units.

Is interest still in favor of giving this a try? Is Fred still interested in donating the space if I bring bagels?

[Titanium Dome]

No surprise I'm sure, but the L7 is a different speaker with 200W+, and that's what I'd aim for to realize its potential. It'll play loud with less, but it'll play better with more.

[opimax]

the DQ-10s are some of the most inefficiant speakers I have hooked up. I blew the internal fuses when using a smaller amp and have not blown them when using a higher powered amp. I have all wheel drive too but no ice in the mountains please . I also could bring 120TIs if there is interest or dq-28s, everything is else is small, l20, l20t3...and of course some Radio Shack Minimus 7s

I have a pair of very rough L250 w/TI drivers in them I would bring I could get help carrying them. Might have the TI XOvers in them by the time we meet. They would need dry weather, they won't fit inside my Baja

Mark

[BMWCCA]

No surprise I'm sure, but the L7 is a different speaker with 200W+, and that's what I'd aim for to realize its potential. It'll play loud with less, but it'll play better with more.

Dome: The Crown PS-400 should be around 250 wpc at 6-ohms. Have you ever tried the L7 bi-wired in any of the configurations in the owners manual? And why couldn't you use two identical amps with one's L/R output feeding the lows on each L7 and the other amp's L/R output feeding the highs? JBL's diagrams call for one stereo amp for each speaker. Seems odd and confusing for the input attenuators to not be left and right in a rack.

JE's 4333A's should certainly adequately play the role of the legendary L300. No need for Heather to go to the effort of hauling the L200+ around. That was the advertising claim for the L300 at the time anyway: "The L300 is the home entertainment version of the 4333 Studio Monitor. . . No need for everyone to haul their stuff around unless there are other comparos desired! The L7s are a bit under 75-lbs. each and they are slim enough to "hug" so one person can carry them if need be (for when my wife just says, "You're crazy" and walks away). They won't fit in my trunk like the L5s so I'll have to resurrect the van one more time. As far as I'm concerned the more the merrier, but it's "Fred's" house.

JE, I will call, but to answer first: The L7s don't appear to be that hungry but I've never run them with anything less than a DC300A-II or PS-400 . It's easy for me to bring a couple of Crowns along and everything to hook them up for the L7s. Then we'll have two systems for sure and we can play with any configuration we think is equitable. We can play each pair the way we both listen to them (your Adcoms and my Crowns) and then, if we feel the need, give them a level playing field. I might try bi-wiring the L7 with two amps to see if it makes any difference. We don't need to make this any more invasive of your hospitality than it already is! A single source should be a good start.

I realize I'm also tied-up the weekend of Oct. 24-26, and I'm not sure how a Thursday works for Heather or Opi. I'll toss out two Sundays, 11/2 or 11/9, and see what others say.

Happy to take this off list until we have results to share.

[Titanium Dome]

Dome: The Crown PS-400 should be around 250 wpc at 6-ohms. Have you ever tried the L7 bi-wired in any of the configurations in the owners manual? And why couldn't you use two identical amps with one's L/R output feeding the lows on each L7 and the other amp's L/R output feeding the highs? JBL's diagrams call for one stereo amp for each speaker. Seems odd and confusing for the input attenuators to not be left and right in a rack.

My L7s in the downtown office are running off a pair of MTX/Soundcraftsmen A400 amps and a DX4200 pre-amp/EQ. I've got one amp running LF and HF for the left channel and one amp for the right. I can use the DX4200 to control each channel via the Unity Gain Control and make any minor adjustments for each channel's output via the L and R ten band EQ.

Your idea of going LF on one amp and HF on the other would also work in this scenario, but in a different way. The EQ bands would allow you to attenuate all the LF going to the HF amp, and attenuate all the HF going to the LF amp.

Might have to try that.